I just looked a few other proposed X movesets online, a lot of people seem to forget how essential the buster is as a character trait for X. In that sense, I'd be weary of changing the forward tilt away from buster shots since the neutral and forward tilts for most characters should be a generic move they can do and nothing too special.

I could definitely see Fire Wave as a working down tilt though, I personally like when downward moves have a bit of crowd control to them.

What's good about newer Smash games is the customization options, so X could definitely have some alternate specials too (if they add custom specials options). Spinning Blade could be a really good forward smash but also a good forward or neutral special like Mega Man's Metal Blade.

Looking at this X build idea again, it really inhabits the grey area between and echo fighter and a regular fighter... Kind of why I think X would be fine as an echo is that most of the "best" moves to use, when you apply them to the actual in-game inputs, don't really stray far from Mega Man's SSB4 moveset.

It seems political to a lot of fans but I don't think there's anything wrong about a character being an echo fighter. I get the impression that people think it's like an insult that a character is an "echo" instead of a "full" character but in the end I'm just gonna display all fighters separately anyway.

The whole echo fighter thing gets a little murkier when you consider how "clone" characters have evolved. Characters that are straight up clones (even with slightly different attributes) are now echo fighters, but some characters that were originally clones (Ganondorf, Falco) have been tweaked enough they are no longer clones.

Dr. Mario is a good example because his clone status in Melee was oft debated by fans--even though he had totally different physics in every move. He was removed from Brawl because he was deemed a clone, and now here he is in SSBU as a full fledged fighter.

So while Falco in Ultimate isn't an echo-fighter, I see X in a similar role to Falco in Melee; He's basically the same as Mega Man but with slightly altered move effects and hit boxes. Many of his animations don't even need much altering, but even so that's a minimal task at this point (as evidenced by custom moves being available in SSB4). The explicit point of echos being that they have nearly the same animations but can still have different hitboxes and physics.

This build of X would be debateable if it's an echo or not, kind of depends on your view of Falco's Melee version I guess.

This is fun to think of. What about:


Up Tilt: Dragon Punch. Like Mega Man, he does a nice SF uppercut.
Down Tilt: Not sure on this one, open to suggestions but I kind of think it should be a simple move rather than an actual special weapon.
Forward Tilt: Buster. Same thing as Mega Man except it does damage (but lower fire rate).
Neutral Attack: Buster lemons.

Dash Attack: This one's obvious. Instead of Top Spin, X will dash here (even if X doesn't visibly have the boot upgrade ). Comparable distance and damage can be done with this move, but with an added bonus to get a longer jump distance out of it.

Up Smash: Sonic Slider. A quick smash attack will give you only 2 blades, but charged you'll get the full lot to rain down in the area around you.
Down Smash: Ground fire. Two fireballs arc away from X, and land away from him (you could his character model between him and the fire) and burn on the ground for a short time.
Forward Smash: Charged buster. Same idea as Mega Man more or less with small differences.

Up Aerial: Storm Tornado. Similar to Mega Man's current moveset, the vertical tornado is an excellent way to push an enemy out of the screen.
Down Aerial: Triad Thunder (charged shot version). In air this is similar to Link's down+A sword stab, but with a small AOE earthquake. Similar to Donkey Kong's slap but less area. When hitting the ground a couple electric balls trace out in each direction (imagine a small version of the hothead item).
Forward Aerial: Similar to Mega Man, but it's the X-Saber instead (or Z-saber, whatever).
Neutral Aerial: Get a little fancy with this one instead, you can shoot buster shots in any of 8 directions at the dash rate.

Up Special: Ice Burst (the charged dash version). You can move vertically or horizontally (quick direction change after hitting the input) through the air but not diagonally. The icicles that fly out can freeze enemies in a block of ice (an effect already in the games) if they have high damage %. Not a popular one of X's moves, but very useable for recovering AND attacking in a Smash Bros game.
Down Special: Rolling Shield (charged). Similar to Leaf Shield, of course.
Forward Special: Hardest for me to pin down, I'm leaning toward a lot from X1 to be honest.
Neutral Special: Chameleon Sting but each laser can bounce once off a wall.

Grab: Silk Shot, can pull them in at a small distance.

Final Smash: Giga Attack? Maybe Nova Strike but on a massive level we've never seen before.

For a little extra fun, let X do a small hadouken ONLY if you do the actual SF2 inputs for it.

X can wall jump at an easier rate than other characters.

I believe this can work as an acceptable echo fighter of Mega Man while still feeling like a whole character. Now someone else do the floor and edge attacks, I'm tired.

It's so hard to get friends over to play Smash these days too, that single player mode is more important than ever. As a kid I was fine with plowing through everything to get to Master Hand over and over on N64, but I need a little more now.

Mikero, Shadow man is a spirit at the 5:49 mark.

Hell yeah, now I know what'll be on every playthrough I do.

People are treating that as a big deal signifier, as if the game doesn't already support scenarios like Samus beating up Samus.

Also, at this point X would be DLC since the direct confirmed that all base-game characters have been revealed.

Yeah... I mean, I was talking more about pre-ordering as a general topic, not specifically MM11, but since you brought up Smash; I looked on the official site and it said this about Piranha Plant:

Purchase and register your game with My Nintendo by Jan. 31 and Piranha Plant will join the battle when it’s available!

And further down the page:

Purchase and register the game by Jan. 31, get Piranha Plant for free!
Register your game with My Nintendo by Jan. 31, 2019, and Piranha Plant will join the battle when it’s available, around Feb. 2019!

How to get Piranha Plant:
Buy the digital version of Super Smash Bros. Ultimate on Nintendo.com or
Nintendo eShop before 11:59 p.m. PT on Jan. 31, 2019 p.m PT. (The game will automatically be registered to your account.)

OR

Buy the retail version and register the game card with My Nintendo before 11:59 p.m. PT on Jan. 31, 2019.

Whether that's true or not, it implies that simply buying the game at launch on December 7th and registering before January 31st will still get you the Piranha Plant for free.

Though part of what they said in the direct WAS 100% about pre-ordering right now: You get double gold points if you pre-order the digital version in the next few days.

That's way more than I expected and unfortunately my boy Shadow Man still isn't there.

Love that the adventure mode looks like a whole game on it's own. Incineroar looks like a ton of fun.


Edit: Looks like Guts Man and Wily are also spirits, which operate very differently from assist trophies. It's similar to how stickers used to work, I guess. Gravity Man is apparently one of the masters you can train spirits with.

It's already the best roster the series has ever had by default.

If anything it probably would make more business sense for them to launch an entirely new series under the MM banner, and I imagine even that wouldn't be on the table currently.

YES. I'm glad you mentioned the tiny UI too. I figure they made it with longevity in mind, so people with larger and clearer televisions/monitors will be playing it in the future... But we're years away from full saturation on 4k TVs.

It really reminds me of playing XBox 360 before I got an HDTV, which is kind of funny 'cause that would have been back when I playing Red Dead Redemption in the first place.

I'm really liking the game but similar to what you said I'm frustrated with how quick and haphazardly they explain anything. Part of that is ALSO the UI since they will mention something very vaguely in the top top left while you're concentrating on the action.

Example 1: I accidentally hit someone with my horse and the cops came at me. Out of the corner of my eye I saw it said (way up in the top left) that I could just surrender and it showed the Triangle button. I pressed it, and my character grabbed the sherriff by his collar. Turns out it said to lock-on first but the time in which I could read that AND implement it was too short.

Example 2: Every time I hunt an animal the game tells me I can't harvest all of it and I need to dump some stuff from my satchel to do so. I open the satchel and I have empty slots in every category. I'll eat some food and make more, but still nothing will get added once I go back to the animal. This was especially frustrating because I managed to kill the first legendary bear almost immediately, but couldn't get any of that meat (just the pelt), which in my head-canon would be quite the boon for my camp.


Apparently there is a message log? I legitimately have never seen the game mention it, but I just looked that up now. Perhaps that will help. I mean... I not-so-recently breezed through 100%-ing Spider-Man in like a weekend without even trying all that hard, so I don't believe the problem is me getting too old for this #####. It's just a dark spot on an otherwise fun experience.

OK, not to poop on another party but pump the brakes a bit here. This is good stuff but it's more indicative of the strength of digital sales rather than the Megaman franchise's viability. Aside from the prospect of X9 being mouth-dehydrating (to me), nothing here leads me to believe X9 is seriously on the table. YET.

In fact this line...

Mega Man X Legacy Collection, Mega Man X Legacy Collection 2 and Mega Man X Legacy Collection 1+2 (for PlayStation 4, Nintendo Switch, Xbox One and PC in all three cases) performed well thanks to a dedicated fan base and strong brand capabilities.

... is generally not enough for a company to go on. When judging the prospect of making a wholly new title, they don't care about seeing the niche group (us) return. They have to guarantee NEW users if they plan to make a profit. If anything, sales of Mega Man 11 would be a better gauge for them than MMXLC in terms of cost-benefit ratios of developing a whole new game.

It's even kind of funny because of course MMXLC 1 and 2 are in profit THIS year, those were already developed years ago and got a bump this year because they were ported to Switch (a minimal cost for Capcom).

Sorry to hear that, Speed. If it helps, my mother has has mutiple T.I.A. ministrokes over the past ~10 years (none as bad as the very first) but she has had a full recovery every time. I think in all she had 2 or 3 of them, but it's been years since the last one (knock on wood) and she's doing really well. She's still as strong in spirit and mind as ever.

With my mother they were induced mostly by stress (though she also needs to lose a lot of weight), so be mindful of stress with your father, but also with yourself in times like this as Rez mentioned.

I played a bit of Red Dead last night but I was super tired and stopped after some intro stuff but so far I'm really enjoying it. I can't wait to get off work and go back into it already.

I have that issue. I'm not much farther than you (as of that post) but I tried to play when I was a bit tired and the game was far too overwhelming.

I'm really liking the game but I have a few little issues that niggle at me, like how small the boxes are that actually tell you how to do things, and how quickly they disappear. I also need to have a lot of trigger discipline with a DS4 because it's very easy to accidentally shoot. I'm finding it hard to be a good guy just because I keep messing up controls, haha

So far aesthetically I prefer Earthbound. I think it's general locale of contemporary towns and cities with it's eclectic enemies and weirdo story just hit me a certain way, but since I've only just begun Mother 3 I don't know yet what to expect. The small town is interesting but those are the things that grabbed with EB, back in those days I'd never seen an RPG that wasn't high-fantasy. Character design is definitely similar but Mother 3 looks to take a bit more "out-there" with humans, which I like for variety. Either way, in both games any adult woman wearing lipstick looks creepy as all hell.

Can't deny some of Mother 3's gameplay improvements though. Saving via frogs is very welcome, as much as I love the charm of having to use your money to call your dad to save in EB.

---

^ That was written early into the game. The setting is more urban now, which is fun. As a kid that gripped me with what I'd seen of Earthbound but also the original Pokemon.

Red Dead 2nite, I'm very excited.

It never occurred to me to face left when entering any boss room.

Robin is a special case because the sword is a form of magic and you can't use it the entire time. While not the best of the FE fighters, Robin is probably my favourite (or close to) FE addition because of the actual difference in gameplay.

I'm an FE fan so I would love if instead of some FE characters, like possibly Ike (even though his moveset is different from the general Marth-clone) we got someone like Hector, who uses an axe. Or god forbid someone who uses a TOME or BOW. But if we're being honest they only add the very huge and titular characters from the franchise. Chrom seems like a poor addition already because Lucina fills both the role of wielding the falchion and being the representative from FE: Awakening ALONG WITH Robin. There is no point adding him in, he's not even really promoting the game now. In general, any time they pull a main character from a fantasy game this will probably be an issue. The whole genre seems scared of having the main character be anything other than a glorified knight.

I don't know, I've thought a lot about the Smash Bros. franchise's character issues since Smash 4, especially when they had write-in ballots for fighters. Bear with me here... I don't think it's about removing past characters, the problem is they keep adding swordsmiths when they shouldn't. To that effect, I'm not saying Zero wouldn't be a good addition; He'd be fantastic. He would have a wholly unique moveset, art syle, nostalgia, everything that makes a good Smash character. The problem is they put Shulk in the game, which was the perfect Zero slot.

To my chagrin, Corrin exemplifies NONE of the traits of a good Smash character like Zero would, and is only there to promote a very bad Fire Emblem game. Corrin is possibly the worst aesthetic design in FE: Fates, let along being yet another boring sword user. Corrin is probably the lone character I'd actually suggest removing from Smash Bros.

Obviously the whole idea behind Smash Bros. Ultimate having every character ever is to stop all the bitching that happens when characters get taken out. To a degree, I support that; Once a character is entered into the game I don't much reason to take them out. Especially with the ability to now have echo fighters, I think it's fun to have all the options like SNK vs. Capcom 2 did. Something I don't like about the Street Fighter series is they consistently introduce new characters then bin them, but keep the same core SF2 ones intact 'cause the game is apparently only successful for that reason. I think the problem of balancing out what kinds of characters we get should always be tackled at the ADDITION stage.

I would tell Nintendo not to worry about removing characters, just be smarter with adding them in the first place. We're done adding Fire Emblem characters to Smash Bros. for a while. Go through your ballot e-mails and take my Dig Dug suggestion, already.

I haven't bought it yet either, I just have too much going on these days that I'm way behind or I have to justify games I REALLY want like Spider-Man or RDR2. MM11 isn't something that's going away or that I need a rush, the beauty of the game is that you can play whenever and have a fun time, like how games used to be (and still should be).

I'm totally against pre-ordering unless it's an exclusive collector's edition that comes with a physical statue or other doohickey, though. "Missing" content via not pre-ordering is some bull#####. The whole pre-order sales business is corrupt on both sides, the retailer and the developer/publisher. It abuses the consumer.

If they do DLC there won't be a "complete" edition.  It's too small a game to repress the disc or cart with the DLC added, plus Capcom almost always just rereleases the same base disc with a #####ing voucher to download the DLC so you don't actually get it because the DLC is still separate from the game and not on disc.

Just buy it now.

While true, you're only thinking physical editions. Which I get, I prefer to buy physical as well. But they can easily "repackage" the digital version as a complete edition.

While I do think Zero would work great in Smash Bros. and be a lot of fun, the last thing we need is another sword user.

The thing with Mega Man (At least the Classic Series goes), because every game is enjoyable to play, there is no end-all be all ranking.  Everyone is going to have a differing opinion on which their favorites are.  Sure 1 and possibly 8 are going to be towards the lower end, but every game is genuinely a blast to play.

I agree to an extent. There's no BAD classic MM games and everyone will thus have a different order of favourites but I think it's still fun to discuss.

For me personally I can't put MM1 at the bottom just because it doesn't have some of the newer features of the others. If I'm looking purely for a fun-time, I would probably pick MM1, and even MMII, over MM8. It's all personal, but I find MM8's story (voice acting aside) better than it's actual gameplay in the end.

Started, and got way into, Hyper Light Drifter on Switch.

---

Beat Hyper Light Drifter pretty quickly, I know it's years late compared to people who played it on other platforms but man that game is a gem.

Started playing Mother 3 now. It's my first time with it, finally, but it's good so far.

No I definitely think 4 is a great one, love the RM designs in it. I just think 1-3 and 7 are much better than, say, 10. But MM3 is probably my favourite one at this point.

time to go back into hiding.

Don't. We miss you.

My Mega Man rankings are as followed.  Keep in mind that all of the games are good. 

4 > 11 > 9 > 10 > 5 > 6 > 3 > 7 > 2 > 8 > 1

I'm having alot of fun with 11 and it's definitely in my top 3.

Didn't expect that order at all. Definitely a more unique take than mine would be, especially with MM1-3.

My issue is a well composed musical score should sound good regardless of the particular instrument. I've heard great songs where all the actual intruments were swapped (for example instrumental to digital and vice-versa) and they remained great songs. I think "fixing" it b making it 8-bit is just a poor workaround, it just should be done right in the first place. It's unfortunate that it's even a conversation.

I also have a sneaking suspicion that some of these stage hazards were made with a cheap editor program that may have survived from that Mega Maker-type game a few years ago, since stuff like Torchman's stage has some very simplistic but overly blocky designs. That, or they were forced to use MMPU to design some stage elements early and just expanded the screen size later on.

Now that you mention it I can see that. Certain parts felt a bit hastily put together and less designed in the demo even.

I read the spoilers here 'cause I didn't really expect them to be plot based, which they aren't really, but I'll tag this just in case.

[spoiler]To be honest I'm not surprised about Bass and Proto Man not showing up. It honestly seems like any new installments we get to the classic franchise will shy away from moving the actual story further. Obviously, Mega Man is more about the gameplay but part of why we're STILL here talking about MM has to be attributed to the charm of that design and world building.

Unfortunately, the last time we really had any evolution to the story beyond "bad robots! go kill!" was probably Power Fighters with it's Zero stuff. MM9 and MM10 do nothing to increase the lore beyond what we had in MM8, and for me that's kind of a shame.

I don't need an MM game to be plot HEAVY, but it kind of sucks that every new Mega Man game doesn't have much other than the gameplay. It's not 1985, we can have both the solid gameplay and a nicer story than "uhh... Roboenza?" [/spoiler]

I actually really love MM7, don't see what other people dislike about it.

Haha well that's a good update! Going back to that, I do agree. I couldn't really be bothered to remember the order of customized weapons and generally only swapped between the latest two I'd created anyway.

I'mma wait a bit to get it but I'm glad it's not horrible. Stage design is a big thing though, and I wasn't impressed by the demo in that way. I don't trust reviewers full-stop, so I like hearing what you guys say about it.

It would have been more conceptually interesting if losing 90% of reploids made the world a BETTER place. Then you could have had X dealing with a notion of "maybe we were the problem all along". Or even the reverse. That way a disaster event on that scale wouldn't have been so flimsy in the established storyline of the X series. Basically, the elf wars (if included) should never have been the "end" of X's journey.

But if you're making a series about Zero I guess you gotta make edgaaaaaay as fuuuuudge.

most i see elf wars adding is levels of fighting 'floating-in-air-annoying-to-hit-going-through-walls' type enemys being all you fight with a big one at the end

It's been a looooonnng time since I ventured into it but I never got the impression that the Elf Wars were actually about fighting ELVES themselves. I assume it's like Star Trek's eugenics wars, where basically you had reploids/mavericks fighting each other with the use of the cyber elves as a sort of enhancement/weapon.

Star Link isn't a new Star Fox game.  He's just a guest character.

Exactly why I asked.

Surely the X staff is all too aware of the taint that is his presence. Unlike Bass, Axl doesn't seem to add any real depth to the story, except for being a protagonist to represent the "New-Gen Reploids", which seems to be a plot that could handle itself well without him.

At least Bass stood as a real rival in the Classic series. Axl is just, well.... I wouldn't know what to call him. A "means for extra gameplay"?

My take is that Axl is essentially a kid sidekick. Or in a sense, he's what happens if all of us making fan characters back then actually PUT our characters into the game. Except with even worse writing. He's like his own type of mary sue that's even worse.

Bass was great because for the most part he was consistently a rival that didn't get along with Mega Man. Outside of MM&B they never really see eye to eye.

It's just about writing with integrity. Bass was a well-thought out character from top to bottom, his existence has purpose and makes sense with the established storyline. What can Wily do to beat Mega Man? Make a better Mega Man. On the flipside, the entire basis for Axl's existence was "what if I put like my fanboy son into the game?"

I like the longer levels but I think it's silly still have lives be a thing in 2018. It's like having a time limit. Something I like in modern games are when the game is tough but I can just keep going. Like Super Meat Boy. Though I guess it could be difficult to have a Mega Man game without limiting lives.

 

it's too early to judge the game based on the demo alone.

Your point is sound but there's little else to do for now
Gotta assume the whole wheel of cheese is the same as the sample.

But having seen some others play the demo now I can see better how you don't need the gears. I may have over thought it, or just didn't put the time in.

I just wish there was a way to turn off the gears.  I don't want to "accidently" use them.

A "classic" mode would be nice. You could even take off the power selection wheel and some other things just to give it an extra nostalgia feel without sacrificing anything. (And that would be a good place for a limit on lives too)

That part were you're trying to jump on all the falling the blocks feels like they really just want to make you use the speed gear. It's certainly doable without, but it's obvious they want me to play that way and I don't like the way that kind of design feels. Otherwise the demo is decent.

If Axl has to remain a character for "story purposes" (which I don't agree with), then he should be a side character and non-playable.

til the new Star Fox releases next month,

Starlink? Or am I missing some news?

I would actually prefer if a character could wall-jump over double jump.

Roll should work like a Dustforce character.

given the demo couldn't strike a good balance between the gears and going gearless,

Lost power for a few days this weekend so I finally cracked open the demo and this was my big issue. I don't really want to use the gear system, but I felt very much forced to.

You can turn the voice acting off as it is its own separate option from sound and music.

And it reminds me of MM8 so I'm cool with it.

Good to know. I still haven't played the demo or anything to see.

Didn't expect to like Tundra Man but he's cool. I didn't really dig the design intially but now seeing that he's a figure skater it all works well. I don't know if the weapon you get from him is really appropriate to his character--That spinning move or the skating dash would have been better (especially the dash because that could give MM a more X-like momentum move), but it's all good.

... I still don't like the RM's talking constantly during the fight.

I believe he's owned by Nintendo, as he was created specifically for the SNES version of Sim City. Plus a character based on him appeared in a couple Zelda games.

The Wright* way

I don't care about the amiibo thing much, I personally just think it was better in past games that E-tanks weren't just given out so plainly.

Is the gameplay itself rougher or the actual physical parts that Limited Run made?

A swinger's life isn't all it's cracked up to be my friend, believe me.  You're better off with Mega Man.

Until I play the demo and know for sure, I think the assured safety of thwips is better than the potential pews.

Yeah Spider-Man is a lot of fun.

And I want a #####ing proper boss fight with Bass.  Bass's whole motivation was to prove he was the strongest and he just was nowhere in 9 and playable in 10 as his own character.  The rivalry needs to continue.

Totally agree. Bass was set up to be the Vegeta of this series and they just kind of bailed on it. It's a bummer. Bass has one of the best character designs in all the MM franchises.

Have yet to play the demo because I've been swinging around NYC...

Because until X is announced as a fighter, the only MM characters and stages are from Classic Mega Man (outside of the final smash cameo). I'm not against it but I'm still with Rez on this, smarter to keep it classic.

Just my opinion but it's not the same as having different Zelda tracks even though Link is the BOTW version, since that's still the same series. The X and Classic series have a completely different methodology to them.

Eyy... A lot of people really liked BN, I think you're in a minority there Xero.

The first 3 games are great (or more specifically: Great, excellent, and good). They fell off big time after that, but I would easily buy a collection just to revisit those first three.

It really wouldn't be too different from the X collection in that respect, and it's pretty clear that Capcom isn't going to bother with a new BN game at this point anyway.

I have yet to ever sully my hands with X7 or X8 and I don't plan to anytime soon.

so good

lel.

Does he have a french accent?

He does roll his R's but that's not a french accent, or if that's the attempt it's pretty bad (whether they're trying France, Quebec... Haiti, none of those sound like that). I've seen people say he sounds like an overdramatic and over-stereotypical Scandinavian (aka Tornbjorn from Overwatch). To be honest I wouldn't be surprised if the accent was trying to be Turkish or something either.

Regardless, I hope I can mute that #####. He's delivering lines like every dwarf in every fantasy film ever.

Yeah I'm lucky to still have mine working and have a 3rd party adapter, but I would hate to put wired controllers and connect that to the flimsy Switch dock.

[spoiler="DO NOT CLICK ON THIS UNTIL ON OR AFTER AUGUST 17TH 2018"]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ooG15l_pCko[/spoiler]

I was talking about the Smash branded ones, AKA "official" ones. I don't see the reason why new official ones have to use the old plug instead of being wireless akin to the pro controller.

It's just interesting how people argue over whether a character should be an echo or not, haha.