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25 September 2017, 05:59:27
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The MBoard  |  MegaMan Series  |  X Series  |  Topic: 20XX, a modern X style game
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Author Topic: 20XX, a modern X style game  (Read 226 times)
Johncarllos
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« on: 1 September 2017, 22:34:59 »

I'm not sure if you guys have heard of of 20XX, but I saw it and figured I'd give it a shot. It was on sale, and only came out a couple of weeks ago, but it's an indie take on X style gameplay that is actually a lot of fun.

The steam page is Here.

I'm done a couple of playthroughs and the concept is fun, it's like a rougelike MMX clone with VERY similar gameplay and procedural generation.

The best part? Local AND Online co-op that is smooth as butter.

This biggest turnoff for me is the art style and how sloppy the protagonist's sprites are. All wiggly and crap. But if you're like me and stop looking at your character and just focus on jumpan and shootan, it's pretty sweet.

Also, normal mode only gives you one life, you die and it's over.

My steam name is Johncarllos if you don't have me added already. Worth picking up as a simple $15 throwback to the X formula with some co-op.


ALSO worth noting is that I've dealt with no glitches or serious impediments to gameplay at all. Controls are tight, and everything feels RIGHT.
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RedBeard
Majikn
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« Reply #1 on: 5 September 2017, 21:17:55 »

I think my biggest turnoff from playing Zero and ZX is that they already seem roguelike with how bored I was when experiencing the level design. Some people here just say those games are bad; every time I've tried to pick one up I found it genuinely unplayable.
I do wonder how this game compares to them. Maybe I'd like it more simply because my expectations are different.
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TheRedPriest
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« Reply #2 on: 5 September 2017, 21:21:40 »

The games are just kind of bad, but the level design and power switching are horribly done as well, which piles up to make a bad game.
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NovaMan XP
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« Reply #3 on: 6 September 2017, 06:21:08 »

I think it was in Zero 2 that I got insta-killed by a falling spike ceiling that was off-screen, and there was no way of knowing it was even there before I was killed by it.

I might be remembering wrong because it's been over 10 years, but I don't think the stage design in ZX was nearly as bad, but the form switching made for crap gimmick. They could've easily handled it like the armors in the X series instead. Instead of getting Model H you instead unlock the ability to hover in Model X, or double jump in Model ZX. Stuff like that instead of being forced to change forms every time there's an obstacle that you can't get past.

I've heard of 20XX, not sure if I would like it or not, but I'll probably give it a shot at some point in the future.
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TheRedPriest
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« Reply #4 on: 6 September 2017, 13:01:16 »

You remember just fine.  Zero and ZX were horse #####.
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Mikero
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« Reply #5 on: 6 September 2017, 14:18:01 »

I'll have to see more of 20XX's gameplay but I don't think it's my style. Which is unfortunate because I'm all for it and I'm a big fan of people using what is essentially a perfect game (MMX) to design new stuff, but I really don't like the art direction at all as it is. I wish they went for pixel animation over that super smooth flash style.

Just a personal thing but I've never liked that kind of look in any game, it always reminds me of Newgrounds games (some of which were incredible) that I played for free. Plus I have an animator's brain, and generally that art style comes with way too smooth and even animation. It's not just an indie issue either, a lot of professional studio games do it, this was my problem with Rayman Legends.

I have other art and animation issues with 20XX, but I'm likely being too harsh on an early-access indie title. Buuut I'm wary of letting things go because "it's early-access" or "it's indie" in general.
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Majikn
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« Reply #6 on: 6 September 2017, 19:22:11 »

The whole early access thing isn't something I'm not, strictly speaking, against but it seems easy to use the fact that something is "early access" to deflect criticism, which is especially weird because you're basically charging people to play your alpha/beta and offer feedback; developers should be welcoming it. I dunno how much the 20XX people took advantage of said feedback beyond fixing the bugs people found, but it isn't early access anymore, so we're at the point that pretty much what you see is what you're getting.

If they received said feedback and went along with the flash animation look anyway, I imagine it's probably because it's just what they knew and wanted to do, and stayed the course even when some people didn't like it. I could respect and understand that but the reality remains that yeah, it's pretty meh.

I'm going to give this game a shot and keep an open mind. Though I imagine I will have a lot to nitpick about it, I feel like I'll have a lot of fun with it.
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Mikero
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« Reply #7 on: 6 September 2017, 19:49:28 »

The whole early access thing isn't something I'm not, strictly speaking, against but it seems easy to use the fact that something is "early access" to deflect criticism

Exactly. And then games languish in that state as the developers move on to something else, since the game has that "good enough I guess" sticker slapped on it (see: ARK Survival Evolved)
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TheRedPriest
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« Reply #8 on: 6 September 2017, 21:15:55 »

Game making in general has gotten canceriously bad in the last half decade.  But why would people try anymore when you can do cheap ass free to play style mobile games and make more than you ever do on a real game with real effort?
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Johncarllos
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« Reply #9 on: 8 September 2017, 21:27:28 »

20XX was in early access but the game has been fully released, I believe. It's still indie, but it's not pricey.

A lot of me got caught up in the style of a MMX game that actually plays really well. I agree that the flash-style art is garbage, but I stopped noticing the ugly main character sprites pretty quickly, as the enemy sprites don't detract at all.

If anyone does pick it up, I will play with you.
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RedBeard
Majikn
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« Reply #10 on: 12 September 2017, 07:16:05 »

Some preliminary thoughts:

I overall like this game so far.

I thought a lot of the music was samey and not in like a great way, and I'm glad I didn't buy the OST or anything, but getting to the final levels has some measure of feeling rewarding and the music starts to really complement this feeling. Even then it seems like you barely have a chance unless you complete an armor set in a run (which is quite often up to luck; you have to earn chances to grab armor pieces through the gameplay and what you're rewarded with isn't always something you want). I've completed two armor sets and it was only in those instances I've come close to finishing the game.
I have level 9's stage music in my head right now. The 9th stage is of course relative to the placement of the first Wily stage in any MegaMan game. I found the music very fitting for having reached that point, but not in the same way that MegaMan's music is. That's as much as I'll say without spoiling it, but it's all about the mood of the piece and it stood out to me in a way that most of the game's music didn't.

I love the little throwbacks to X and Zero stuff. There are quite a few blatant references that show that this was more than just a ripoff of MMX but a loveletter to the X and Classic series as a combined whole.

The first time I got to the final boss, it was in easy mode in co-op with my girlfriend. I had a huge handicap due to the desync basically eating a vast majority of my attempts to grab the boss abilities, so I had to choose a reward that would affect the host's character and so it would benefit both of us. I must stress that she's the only one who had boss abilities of any kind. I was on my last life when my girlfriend died at a certain point in the last level, and I couldn't revive her, but the armor set I'd completed gave me a specific bonus which I wouldn't have been able to beat the game without (which isn't to say it was impossible; I just probably wouldn't have made it on one life). Beating it felt cathartic after we'd been playing together for the better part of the entire day. To give you a measure of our combined abilities, each run took about an hour so it was a lot of failed runs. It surprised me that she even likes the game considering she's a lot bigger on games like Skyrim and Red Dead Redemption and isn't very into old-fashioned games at all.

I know I've ragged on the art and I can say it's probably the worst aspect of the game. I'm not going to go on too much about it, but think amateur pseudo-anime webcomic and that's what you're getting. That being said I'm referring mostly to the execution. The only character DESIGNS I dislike, incidentally, are the two main characters. The rest of them I'd give a pass. On the other hand I think the environments and background designs are my favourite aspect of the art.

And I don't think I went into enough about how the energy weapons feel zappy and the explosions feel explodey. Lots of effort went into the detail of these things.

I like the multiple different armor sets and how they all appear on your character model.

I like that you're not forced to play as different characters in co-op.

Keep in mind that that the mechanics mimic X more than Classic, which makes it a bit off-putting sometimes that a lot of the game is precision platforming in the vein of Classic. However I think it's cool that it seems to keep track of what abilities you have when it generates a new level. You'll get the midair dash and then in the next area there are secrets you'll only be able to access with the midair dash. It happens in such a way that it doesn't seem like coincidence, though it doesn't always seem to happen which keeps it from being too predictable in that way, though of course you'll eventually encounter the predictable because procedural generation will only take things so far.

It does seem like the boss abilities are uninspired and not very useful, but maybe that's because I've played a lot as Nina with whom the charge shot alone will help you through many of the games challenges.

I'll be down to continue playing this for a while and trying out different modes, and I'd probably be interested in a sequel if there ever is one.
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Johncarllos
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« Reply #11 on: 13 September 2017, 18:36:39 »

I agree with everything you said.

You made it farther with your girlfriend than you did with me, but we only played for what, 2 hours?
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RedBeard
TheRedPriest
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« Reply #12 on: 13 September 2017, 18:54:34 »

I would hope he made it farther with his girlfriend than you...
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Johncarllos
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« Reply #13 on: 14 September 2017, 21:16:02 »

I can get pretty far in 2 hours, Rez.
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RedBeard
TheRedPriest
Matrix Marine
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« Reply #14 on: 15 September 2017, 02:57:20 »

...that's not what I meant.
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Majikn
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« Reply #15 on: 15 September 2017, 20:59:10 »

I want to see how far we can get with Rez.

Perhaps we should take turns.
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The Exorcist has taught me that when I am losing an argument I may save face by vomiting on the opposition.
TheRedPriest
Matrix Marine
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Posts: 2155



« Reply #16 on: 15 September 2017, 21:41:48 »

No need to take turns.  You can both go to the mauling tent together!  Aren't you lucky?
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Majikn
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« Reply #17 on: 16 September 2017, 10:35:54 »

Will Nibbles be gentle if it's my first time?

Anyway we've beaten the game twice now and the last time we did it was on one life. Unfortunately we didn't both make it to the end. Still working on that. She finds the platforming stuff really difficult.

Given her response to this I might actually be able to get her into REAL Mega stuff, which would be really cool.
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The Exorcist has taught me that when I am losing an argument I may save face by vomiting on the opposition.
TheRedPriest
Matrix Marine
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Posts: 2155



« Reply #18 on: 17 September 2017, 03:01:06 »

I don't know, there are some great games, but there is literally no future for Mega Man.  It's kind of like "here is some delicious food, oh and then you can never eat again".
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NovaMan XP
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« Reply #19 on: 18 September 2017, 19:41:00 »

Does that mean replaying the great games is like regurgitating the food and then eating it again?
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TheRedPriest
Matrix Marine
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Posts: 2155



« Reply #20 on: 18 September 2017, 21:38:44 »

Yes.  It's exactly like that.
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Doctor Mario is not a real doctor.  Do NOT let him touch your genitals.
Majikn
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Posts: 2201



« Reply #21 on: 22 September 2017, 04:14:12 »

Good enough for me.
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The Exorcist has taught me that when I am losing an argument I may save face by vomiting on the opposition.
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The MBoard  |  MegaMan Series  |  X Series  |  Topic: 20XX, a modern X style game
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